Germany SUCKS! Guantanamo Rules!
Hey there… I myself am a german and can be proud of our printing technology, cars, albert einsteins and many other things.. but isn’t it funny on how fast I can turn into a person that is NOT proud of his country just because of the actual politics going on?
I’d like to talk a little bit about a German-Turk named Murat Kurnaz. This guy was born in germany having turkish parents that raised him in germany. To tell you a bit of what you will find after this text, it’s about the fact that USA kidnaped Murat Kurnaz into Guantanamo Bay (USA Torture Prision) stating he was connected to Al-Quaida and was a terrorist. In fact there are enough official documents where officials stated that there was NO evidence or reason to believe he had any contact with terrorists.
The bummer on this whole issue is that after 4 and more years sitting and being tortured in guantanamo bay pleading for his release and leading a good conduct, etc… Guantanamo Prision actually admited that there was no proof to hold him longer in prision.. but NOW that he could be released.. the same mother fukin germany (Angela Merkel and CO.) who pleaded for his release WON’T let him back into germany!
WHY you ask? Well.. now that they now that there was NO reason for Murat Kurnaz to be in prision and that he never supported the idea of terrorism or anything against USA.. they are “AFRAID” that thanks to the time in guantanamo he “MIGHT” have changed his point of view about terrorism and now is a “a danger to public safety and order”.
Here a bit from the german newspaper SPIEGEL:
At Camp Delta, Guantanamo, Murat Kurnaz is seen as one of the less troublesome prisoners. Unlike some of his fellow inmates, he doesn’t save his urine in dusty plastic bottles to throw over the guards. Nor has he taken part in the hunger strike that 84 of the prisoners are holding. The Turk from Bremen even assured a US military tribunal, “I hate terrorists.
I’ve lost several years of my life because of Osama Bin Laden.” He wants to give the German authorities any information voluntarily “to show that I don’t support terrorism, so that I can sleep peacefully.”
This good conduct has done little to help Kurnaz so far. The “Bremen Taliban” has been held prisoner at Guatanamo for four years and whereas almost all the other European terror suspects have been sent back to their homelands — Britain, France or Sweden — nothing seems to have moved in Kurnaz’s case. That might be about to change.
The German government is now making discreet moves together with the Turkish government for his release. Kurnaz is the son of Turkish immigrants and has a Turkish passport, although he was born and raised in Germany. Shortly before Christmas the German embassy in Ankara confidentially sounded out the Turks on whether they would be open to working together for Kurnaz’s release.
German Chancellor Angela Merkel’s foreign affairs advisor, Christoph Heusgen, explained that the new government would plead for Kurnaz’s release on “humanitarian grounds”. The Federal Foreign Office has confirmed “contact at a diplomatic level” but would not give any further details. Turkish officials have already hinted that Kurnaz could possibly be free by March.
It’s the most movement there has been so far in the case. Until now the Turks have shown little or no interested in Kurnaz. After three years of fruitless contacts with the embassy and consulate his mother Rabiye finally went to Ankara in the spring of 2005 and spoke directly to an official at the Turkish foreign office, who simply acknowledged that they were aware of the case.
“If the Germans don’t get involved,” Rabiye Kurnaz complained, “then the Turks won’t lift a finger”…
..read more on spiegel about this here: Guantanamo Prisoner
May 21st, 2006 at 4:59 pm
My friend here you have put too many issues.
First of all nobody knows how many are the prisoners in Guantanamo and from which nationalities. Most likely the majority of them are Muslims in religion but nowadays every single western country has a Muslim minority, some small some bigger.
Second issue and I think is far more important is how many Guantanamo there are. It seems, according to some press releases that there are Guantanamos from the Balkans to Pakistan and Afghanistan. The thing is that when it comes to the original Guantanamo in Cuba at least there is a hope to find out what’s going on and governments like the German can still do something for their citizens. What about the ones who are in the other Guantanamo? They are simply doomed because nobody knows or wants to know anything about them. And in that nobody is included the American administration that is responsible in that and the countries that host those Guantanamos. You see in our eager to stop terrorism we managed to cooperate with some of the worst regimes on earth like the Saudi Arabian or the militaristic dictatorship in Pakistan and even called them in the end allies in the war against terror. That’s another issue.
Coming now to Germany, I think with the election of the new conservative chancellor we were all expecting from her to forget Guantanamo and just be one more in the puppet show that follows the American administration and that was a good surprise. That she still tries to find a way in a government that thinks that rules the universe and can do whatever they like. Unfortunately the power of arms and the economic control USA has on the globe and in extent this administration’s arrogance don’t leave much room to other governments to do except …complain following the usual diplomatic ways.
Turkey is another issue. Turkey is one of the countries; often accuse from NGOs like Amnesty International, and human rights organizations for their behavior towards the Kurdish minority. For the Turkish state even to speak the Kurdish language is enough to send you to their own Guantanamo which most of the time are like coming out of the midnight express. Actually their hunt on the Kurds is leading to genocide with one and only target to make a civilization with history in the Middle East to totally disappear. And here you include their often strikes inside Iraq and Iran bombing innocent women and kids with only one excuse, that they are Kurds and according to the Turks every persons who identifies him/her self as Kurd is a terrorist who should be dead.
How many times the Turkey’s government has asked the German government to send to Turkey Kurds because when they escaped from the Turkey’s militaristic covered ‘democratic’ government, they opened their mouths and said some bitter true about Turkey. Don’t forget that Turkey is another ‘democratic’ ally with Pakistan in the war against terror.
So there is no chance that Turkey will do anything to help poor Mr. Kurnaz, everything is left to the German government. But as I said in the beginning Mr. Kurnaz in all his misfortune he is lucky because at least we know about him. What’s going on in the other Guantanamos where more likely are not half German citizens but just Pakistanis, just Turks or just Afghanis …. God or better only Allah knows.
May 21st, 2006 at 5:09 pm
Regarding the believe that he might has …turned! Well after so long time in Guantanamo for no good reasons it would be a question even for a physiologist if he hadn’t turned. But I think these are stupid excuses and if they wanted to let him they would have done it but the reasons are deeper that he has turned.
Nobody has come out of that hell yet so nobody has really said what’s really going on in there. And I think that’s the biggest issue they are afraid. How a democratic country can excuse everything that’s going on in there and that discredit every single civilized value and believe in democratic institutions.
May 21st, 2006 at 6:58 pm
“What about the ones who are in the other Guantanamo? They are simply doomed because nobody knows or wants to know anything about them.”
-So do you think even if they knew about them like in the case of Kurnaz… that they would actually CARE to get this individual out?
“Mr. Kurnaz in all his misfortune he is lucky because at least we know about him. ”
- Define the WORD “WE”. How much does the GERMAN government really know? You can’t tell me that there are “hidden” guantanamos that the intelligence agencies can’t localize? USA found SADDAM in a freaking Bunny hole! And EU can’t find some complex torture facilities?
Everything you say about turkey and other countries is true and I can’t help it to really don’t care because I AM NOT turkish and I KNOW they will NEVER change mentality … I mean just look at US for an instance the “european union” the “first world countries”… if even germany fails to stand up for it’s citizens (no matter if half turk or not) that have been raised and are germans 100%… then what can we care about ther problems if we can’t even handle our own?`
Angela Merkel seems to be “modern” “agressive” against the USA and it’s world domination ideas.. BUT isn’t that what makes it more suspicious?
On the IRAK war germany TOLD THEIR CITIZENS that germany would NOT participate and colaborate with USA (Gerhard Schröder) and what do we know now? YES GERMANY WAS AN ALLY!!! In fact there are many targets USA could not know without germany and germany supplied landing places and let the USA troops into the country.. AND the worst part… german secret agents were taken to IRAK to supply germany AND USA with information… and still.. officially Germany DENIES to have their hands together with USA in the nice flavoured cake!
Now tell me. What does it matter if in some arabic country some people still throw with stones and AK47’s at women for… fun, when in our “democracy”, freedom.. we are being held for CLOWNS!
USA is becoming a militarized state and that is a FACT and pray to GOD that it won’t happen where we live.. anywhere cause since 98 USA has been killing their own people and terrorizing them.. for what? To prepare them for what comes next. And you know it wont be a happy Alice in Wonderland story!…
Fuck germany has just NOTHING left to be proud of.. Did you hear about all the Nazi killing black people? Man.. I never imagined that would be possible again!… Germany is even WORSE THAN FUKING TURKEY.. why? Because it’s HYPOCRIT.. oh.. yes of course you will say.. BUT there are many “good” things.. bla bla.. well good if you AINT BLACK! Or poor and filthy… fuking nazi germany is horrible because it is supposed to be democratic and “FAIR” but.. it’s just another SANTACLAUS story where we have to grow up to recognize that it’s all a big fake and that “democracy” is only available for very few…
As they say:
Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere.
So is there any “justice” ? Where?
May 21st, 2006 at 7:01 pm
“…but the reasons are deeper that he has turned.”
about that Thanos,
if there ARE “reasons” why not just simply make them public? If you knew a bit more about Kurnaz you would be surprised why he was even considered terrorist when there is nothing that separates him from a 100% germany citizen! Ge gre up there was 19 years as they caught him…
poor guy!
May 21st, 2006 at 7:46 pm
Ok. Let’s take first the things we agree. We both agree that all these Guantanamos are against every principal, every logical institution and every democratic sense. Next we both agree that all these Guantanamos should close not here and now but here and yesterday and all these people should be freed. Most of all and I’m glad for that it seems that we are thousands who agree on that.
Next, everybody is innocent till proven guilty and if the American administration had proven their guilt they would never be there after so long. Which means the administration has a different agenda we don’t know and we must find out, again for principal reasons.
The USA is in front a major crisis at the moment at least this is my opinion, in the name of terrorism this administration goddamns every sense of human rights much worst it does the same even to its own citizens with telephone taping, following people and investigating their personal lives and acts.
If there is justice? I’m not sure. I think the correct answer it would be no because what we call justice is practiced nowadays by humans that influenced by politics and other agendas. Why the drug user goes to prison for a year instead of a clinic and the drug dealer goes out the same day after he paid a million dollars of drug money? Why somebody who is hungry goes to prison for stealing a piece of bread to eat while a minister who stole the money of a whole public lives free? No there is no justice. But in this case what the German government can do while even American citizens cannot do anything with the Guantanamo camp? For them this is politics. And the big fish eats the small fish. What the Europeans are for this American administration? The Germans are puppets that thanks to the Americans have democracy, the French are cowards the rest Europeans are old Europe only new Europe counts because it licks in the most obvious way their ass. Yes master etc.
Is justice in politics? NO! I’m sorry there isn’t. But there is, at least for me, hope! When I see people like you screaming that there is no justice I feel that it will come one day when justice will shine. I know, I know you heard the same things many times. Don’t worry I heard them as well. But believe me, getting older I learned that justice will die when young people like you will stop saying F@#k, what the hell is going on. Is justice in politics? NO! but people like you remind us that there is justice in our spirits and don’t worry, keep the flame and remember that the more they press the bigger the reaction will be when it comes. The French revolution that changed the western world was a result of that pressure.
How odd that 300 years after the French revolution becomes so contemporary!